Hi,

the volumes are just printed on the cover, If you check with wikipedia or imdb you see that the title is "The Animation Show 200x". Due to tmdb has the release year anyways next to the title I left it just as it is now. Probably it is neccesarry to store the title with release year in the title, because it seems to be the original title, but the volumes are just with the cover and that could deffer from country to country.

Well, that's not necessarily true. For year three they were printed on the actual theatrical posetr as well. See here:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/originalalamo/2379845261/

That was posted by the Alamo Drafthouse in San Antonio, and it is identical to the one I purchased at the Lakewood theater here in my hometown.

That said, the theatrical release and the DVD releases were 70%+/- different. Quote from wikipedia: "...the producers stress that the theatrical and DVD lineups are intentionally a little bit different, to encourage audiences to not just wait for the DVD but to visit the cinema and view these films properly. As stated on the Animation Show programs and flyers, once the current edition of the Show is out of theaters, it's "gone forever".

So is the entry here at the website for the theatrical version (which is gone and nobody has) or the dvd release? They are two different lineups for the most part, with a few overlaps in content.

Amazon sells them by volume number and back when www.animationshow.com was active, Mike Judge and Don Hertzfeldt referred to them by volume. I attended live screenings for all 4 years it was active.

if you check their facebook page, which is the last "official" resource from them, they still refer to them by number as well. From this post on May 29, 2009 for the screening of year 4 they titled it: Animation Show 4 (2008) link -> https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.89354776391.82871.89350386391&type=1 Second link -> https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.89358416391.82872.89350386391&type=1

When the official theatrical posters, dvds, and creators all refer to them by volume number, I have a hard time seeing the validity in refraining from keeping that information.

TMDB is usually storing the theatrical releases and therefore we are using imdb as source, at least to verify that title. I know it is not 100% accurate, but it is the biggest database around there. It is usually difficult to get information straight from the movie maker. The volume description let assume that this is not a movie it is a dvd compilation or even a tv series. To keep descriptions like that usually confuses more then it helps, because TMDB doesn’t allow at the moment dvd compilations, boxes or tv series they are also most likely get sold as volumes. I cannot check facebook at the moment, but here – even if it could be an official source – I am not sure to use this as a valid source. TMDB tries to be as accurate as possible and if you think that the volumes are part of the name then you should probably put the volumes back. I would rather go with the years, if I am honest.

I wouldn't be all that invested in this if it didn't create issue from a media browsing perspective.

XBMC does not display years. So one ends up with 3 movies with the exact same name. I'm sure xbmc isn't the only media browser that doesn't pull years from the nfo file and add them to the name.

There is another set that is very similar to this called The Found Footage festival, which has a yearly theatrical tour and they display random old VHS footage they find. Everything is "volumed" through them as well.

I don't want to go around bucking the sites rules, I am simply trying to keep my media in a manner that is browsable without being confusing while also trying to stick to the original naming conventions.

I have run into my own share of problem with IMDB. Recently, on the WWE project we dealt with a guy named James Hellwig who used to wrestle under the name "The Ultimate Warrior". The guy went and got his name legally changed to "Warrior", and even kept it as a surname (so his kids friggin last names are Warrior now... nutter). Anyways, IMDB lists the guy under his former name, Jim Hellwig. Since we were using IMDb as our "bible" we came to crossroad of choosing to use a name that he no longer uses but is recognized at IMDB, or his legal name. On the other hand, you have a wrestler whose real name is Michael Shawn Hickenbottom that wrestles under the name Shawn Michaels. Even though Hickenbottom is his legal name... IMDB has chosen to list him as Shawn Michaels. So, like any site, IMDB is fallible and subject to the whim and perspective of whomever is editing it.

All that said, If you guys would like to keep the volume info out of the title, then that is fine. I can create local nfo files that reflect the names that work better from a browsing perspective. I simply typed up all the above because I felt there was a legitmate case to be made for the name change, and to hopefully show I was not doing it without proper research and justification on my part.

I understand where you are coming from, but you need to know that Tmdb is not just only a backend for Xbmc. Tmdb supports a lot of different systems, webpages, apps and other kind of tools with information. So that is the reason we need to keep a consistency over everything and relay on sources like imdb and wikipedia. I understand that both systems, similar to tmdb are user driven and so the content is just as good as the user are filling it.

Since it has been fixed for a while now, why not start using the alternative names feature? It seems like it could be very useful for your project. I added Jim Hellwig to the Ultimate Warrior profile.

As for IMDB being our "bible", it's not necessarily true. But that site is a very good start for most movies. Personally, I always try to seek out as many sources as possible (within reason, of course).

I had actually put The Animation Show on my list of things to investigate. The reason is that collections such as those may be against our rules. Normally we only allow one movie for every database entry and we don't support different cuts (even though there are a few exceptions in the database).

So if that policy is applied in the strictest sense, and we assume that the animated short films are the original movies, then the collections would become duplicates. However, there are quite a few exceptions in the database already.

EDIT: (And I support the latest post by Mec!as as well!)

The Animation Show features many shorts that are not available anywhere else, so there are no "original" movies. As a matter of fact, several animators such as Bill Plympton created shorts specifically for the show.

The theatrical release in 2003, vol 1, did feature many shorts that were actuall available in their own packages. Frankenweenie by Tim Burton was an extra on his Nightmare Before Christmas DVD, a cartoon about space lifeforms from Disney was available in their Tomorrow Land & Space, etc... So these were all cut from the DVD release with originals added in their place.

Feel free to investigate it however. Just make sure you are looking at the dvd release list and not the theatrical release list. As noted above, they are quite different.

As far as the reminder that Tmdb is not a backend for XBMC, I never stated nor suggested it was. I simply explained where I was coming from. I am aware that TMDB is it's own database, that said, one would think that the movie title actually printed on the dvd and theatrical release poster would have some bearing on the name in the database. Where does "The Animation Show 2005" come from? I am curious as to where that naming convention originated as it is not reffered to like that

here is a theatrical marquee from year four: https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-xUPsDNfEV24/SGQCq4OePXE/AAAAAAAAA7M/P2acCXA2kjM/s250-c-k-no/AnimationShowTheArsenal

and here is one from year 3: http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3627/3567665629_b25f65fc7c_b.jpg

Another from year 3: http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3386/3568472736_a2f7d3e685_b.jpg

You guys see I'm not pulling this out of my ass right? The theatrical marquees, the theatrical posters, the dvds, their official facebook page, amazon - they all name it by numerical order.

quote:

Since it has been fixed for a while now, why not start using the alternative names feature?

They don't get scraped unfortunately, so it doesn't do any good unless I am browsing the site. The name of the movie in any media browser (not just xbmc) is going to be the primary name as it is listed here. But again, the fact I am using this for XBMC doesn't negate the mountain of examples I have provided above in regards to the name.

The theatrical release in 2003, vol 1, did feature many shorts that were actuall available in their own packages. Frankenweenie by Tim Burton was an extra on his Nightmare Before Christmas DVD, a cartoon about space lifeforms from Disney was available in their Tomorrow Land & Space, etc... So these were all cut from the DVD release with originals added in their place

That is what I mentioned above, Tmdb is not supporting dvd compilations. It is possible to add the short movies here, but not the compilations.

Where does "The Animation Show 2005" come from? I am curious as to where that naming convention originated as it is not reffered to like that here is a theatrical marquee from year four: https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-xUPsDNfEV24/SGQCq4OePXE/AAAAAAAAA7M/P2acCXA2kjM/s250-c-k-no/AnimationShowTheArsenal

How theatres or cinemas display the current program in their house is a different story, important is how the producer releasing their own product. There is one official release title and that is what we trying to display here.

You guys see I'm not pulling this out of my ass right? The theatrical marquees, the theatrical posters, the dvds, their official facebook page, amazon - they all name it by numerical order.

No one is saying you did that, we just try to figure out what the official title is. Rotten tomatoes are also just listing them as the animation show per year.

But we can not make an exception for the animation show, due to it is just an compilation of short movies.

No worries then. As I stated above, I can very easily create a local nfo file for my sorting purposes. Thanks for your time.

Thanks